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楼主: lyzhangxiang

PT100做到0.05摄氏度是什么水平 顺便问点ADC的事情

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出300入477汤圆

发表于 2017-3-14 08:26:33 来自手机 | 显示全部楼层
ersha4877 发表于 2017-3-14 06:43
标记下,以后有用来学习,不知道AD采集稳定度用什么滤波算法保持数据不跳动 ...

就是AD厂家替你保证的。你啥算法也不用做,只要电路设计正确,从AD里读到的数差不多就有厂家标称的分辨率。比如标称某状态下noise free 有17位,你做岀来就该有差不多的稳定度,不该低于16位稳定

出235入235汤圆

发表于 2017-3-14 09:03:53 | 显示全部楼层
BOBOD3610 发表于 2017-3-1 11:43
随便一个煤炭或其他物质发热量测定装置温度分辨率和精度要求秒杀你这个水平 ...

这个我到是了解,不说精度,至少分辨率相当吓人。一般做到小数点后4位,并且还比较稳定。好奇其电路,不知您是否了解!

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-3-14 09:36:07 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2017-3-14 08:26
就是AD厂家替你保证的。你啥算法也不用做,只要电路设计正确,从AD里读到的数差不多就有厂家标称的分辨率 ...

了解了,这样说的话只要电路正确,厂家的标称稳定度还是有的,最近在测试ADS1232好象跳动有点大,数据不稳定,但用HP3457对同一信号同时测量看又比较稳定,顾有这么一问,谢谢

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-3-14 10:02:30 | 显示全部楼层
lyping1987 发表于 2017-3-14 09:03
这个我到是了解,不说精度,至少分辨率相当吓人。一般做到小数点后4位,并且还比较稳定。好奇其电路,不 ...

小数点后4位不算高,我朋友的一个板子可以做到小数点后6位,跳动2uV,还是长期运行,电路就是最基本的官方参考电路

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2017-3-14 10:04:53 | 显示全部楼层
ersha4877 发表于 2017-3-14 09:36
了解了,这样说的话只要电路正确,厂家的标称稳定度还是有的,最近在测试ADS1232好象跳动有点大,数据不 ...

厂家白纸黑字写在Datasheet里面的稳定度参数,必须是算数的
你如果怕自己布局布线作不好,可以尽量模仿厂家Demo板的做法。反正厂家的demo板必须达到它自己标称的参数,要不然就是骗人

出235入235汤圆

发表于 2017-3-14 10:27:12 | 显示全部楼层
ersha4877 发表于 2017-3-14 10:02
小数点后4位不算高,我朋友的一个板子可以做到小数点后6位,跳动2uV,还是长期运行,电路就是最基本的官方 ...

你说的是温度还是电压值呢? 我说的是温度呢,如果是,是否了解什么器件?我搭来试试。

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-3-14 11:22:52 | 显示全部楼层
lyping1987 发表于 2017-3-14 10:27
你说的是温度还是电压值呢? 我说的是温度呢,如果是,是否了解什么器件?我搭来试试。 ...

不好意思是电压值,但是也很厉害了,电路图就是基本的图了,芯片是AD7710

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-3-14 16:35:49 | 显示全部楼层
lyping1987 发表于 2017-3-14 09:03
这个我到是了解,不说精度,至少分辨率相当吓人。一般做到小数点后4位,并且还比较稳定。好奇其电路,不 ...

了解,就是对采样速度要求不高,

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-3-14 17:03:26 | 显示全部楼层
fjourdev 发表于 2017-3-2 19:57
搭车 求推荐测温设备:表面测试(铝件表面,接触面积小3*3mm最大有时候脏),用胜利红外线不准!用专用PT那 ...

电池供电的热电偶就可以吧

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-3-14 17:12:28 | 显示全部楼层
migrant 发表于 2017-3-14 17:03
电池供电的热电偶就可以吧

买了个厨房用的 到还靠普 就是想稳定要几分钟

出235入235汤圆

发表于 2017-3-15 10:57:18 | 显示全部楼层
BOBOD3610 发表于 2017-3-14 16:35
了解,就是对采样速度要求不高,

可否分享下思路呢?大概怎么做到的。其实温度信号本身就是慢信号,1秒1次或2次(只要稳定)也不错。我暂时能做到0.02℃的稳定分辨率。

出0入0汤圆

 楼主| 发表于 2017-3-30 23:30:37 | 显示全部楼层
最新进展,还算顺利
搞了两版硬件基本定型,最终用了四层沉金板

一些数据,供大家参考

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18:36:16,3354963,29.995708,99.996529,-0.009017
18:36:18,3354781,29.994080,99.991096,-0.023126
18:36:21,3354792,29.994179,99.991432,-0.022254
18:36:24,3354894,29.995090,99.994469,-0.014367
18:36:27,3354962,29.995699,99.996498,-0.009096
18:36:29,3354902,29.995163,99.994713,-0.013733
18:36:32,3354916,29.995287,99.995125,-0.012663
18:36:35,3354764,29.993929,99.990593,-0.024434
18:36:37,3354935,29.995459,99.995697,-0.011177
18:36:40,3354865,29.994833,99.993607,-0.016606
18:36:43,3354851,29.994705,99.993187,-0.017696
18:36:45,3354912,29.995251,99.995003,-0.012980
18:36:48,3354873,29.994904,99.993843,-0.015992
18:36:51,3354833,29.994545,99.992653,-0.019083
18:36:54,3354909,29.995226,99.994919,-0.013198
18:36:56,3354753,29.993830,99.990265,-0.025286
18:36:59,3354866,29.994841,99.993637,-0.016527
18:37:02,3354831,29.994528,99.992592,-0.019242
18:37:04,3354810,29.994341,99.991966,-0.020867
18:37:07,3354912,29.995251,99.995003,-0.012980
18:37:10,3354824,29.994465,99.992386,-0.019777
18:37:12,3354832,29.994535,99.992615,-0.019182
18:37:15,3354819,29.994421,99.992233,-0.020173
18:37:18,3354908,29.995216,99.994888,-0.013277
18:37:21,3354910,29.995235,99.994949,-0.013119
18:37:23,3355014,29.996164,99.998047,-0.005073
18:37:26,3354830,29.994520,99.992569,-0.019301
18:37:29,3354878,29.994947,99.993988,-0.015615
18:37:31,3354691,29.993275,99.988419,-0.030082
18:37:34,3354981,29.995869,99.997063,-0.007629
18:37:37,3355035,29.996353,99.998680,-0.003428
18:37:39,3354808,29.994322,99.991905,-0.021025
18:37:42,3354704,29.993393,99.988808,-0.029071
18:37:45,3354986,29.995913,99.997208,-0.007253
18:37:48,3354875,29.994923,99.993912,-0.015814
18:37:50,3354744,29.993750,99.989998,-0.025980
18:37:53,3355097,29.996906,100.000519,0.001348
18:37:56,3354954,29.995628,99.996262,-0.009710
18:37:58,3354895,29.995100,99.994499,-0.014288
18:38:01,3354865,29.994833,99.993607,-0.016606
18:38:04,3355036,29.996359,99.998695,-0.003389
18:38:06,3354895,29.995100,99.994499,-0.014288
18:38:09,3354855,29.994743,99.993309,-0.017379
18:38:12,3354832,29.994535,99.992615,-0.019182
18:38:15,3354869,29.994867,99.993721,-0.016309
18:38:17,3355158,29.997452,100.002342,0.006084
18:38:20,3354774,29.994019,99.990898,-0.023641
18:38:23,3354745,29.993759,99.990028,-0.025900
18:38:25,3354770,29.993982,99.990776,-0.023958
18:38:28,3354938,29.995483,99.995781,-0.010959
18:38:31,3354692,29.993284,99.988449,-0.030002
18:38:33,3354893,29.995083,99.994446,-0.014426
18:38:36,3354700,29.993357,99.988686,-0.029388
18:38:39,3355001,29.996046,99.997658,-0.006084
18:38:42,3354809,29.994331,99.991936,-0.020946
18:38:44,3354802,29.994268,99.991730,-0.021481
18:38:47,3354943,29.995529,99.995934,-0.010562
18:38:50,3355008,29.996111,99.997871,-0.005529
18:38:52,3354854,29.994734,99.993279,-0.017458
18:38:55,3354719,29.993526,99.989258,-0.027902
18:38:58,3354706,29.993410,99.988869,-0.028912
18:39:00,3354974,29.995806,99.996857,-0.008164
18:39:03,3354746,29.993767,99.990059,-0.025821
18:39:06,3354857,29.994761,99.993370,-0.017221
18:39:09,3355024,29.996254,99.998344,-0.004300
18:39:11,3354887,29.995028,99.994255,-0.014922
18:39:14,3354879,29.994957,99.994026,-0.015516
18:39:17,3354754,29.993839,99.990295,-0.025207
18:39:19,3354959,29.995672,99.996407,-0.009334
18:39:22,3355010,29.996128,99.997925,-0.005390
18:39:25,3354837,29.994581,99.992767,-0.018786
18:39:27,3355055,29.996531,99.999268,-0.001902
18:39:30,3354713,29.993473,99.989075,-0.028377
18:39:33,3355082,29.996771,100.000069,0.000178
18:39:36,3354857,29.994761,99.993370,-0.017221
18:39:38,3354809,29.994331,99.991936,-0.020946
18:39:41,3354947,29.995564,99.996048,-0.010265
18:39:44,3354769,29.993973,99.990746,-0.024038
18:39:46,3354890,29.995056,99.994354,-0.014664
18:39:49,3354704,29.993393,99.988808,-0.029071
18:39:52,3354769,29.993973,99.990746,-0.024038
18:39:54,3354790,29.994162,99.991371,-0.022413
18:39:57,3354956,29.995644,99.996315,-0.009571
18:40:00,3354765,29.993938,99.990631,-0.024335
18:40:03,3354833,29.994545,99.992653,-0.019083
18:40:05,3354826,29.994482,99.992439,-0.019638
18:40:08,3354799,29.994242,99.991638,-0.021719
18:40:11,3354841,29.994616,99.992882,-0.018489
18:40:13,3354780,29.994072,99.991074,-0.023185
18:40:16,3354769,29.993973,99.990746,-0.024038
18:40:19,3354859,29.994778,99.993423,-0.017082
18:40:21,3354750,29.993805,99.990181,-0.025504
18:40:24,3354947,29.995564,99.996048,-0.010265
18:40:27,3354687,29.993240,99.988304,-0.030379
18:40:30,3354917,29.995296,99.995155,-0.012584
18:40:32,3355018,29.996199,99.998161,-0.004776
18:40:35,3354920,29.995323,99.995247,-0.012346
18:40:38,3354765,29.993938,99.990631,-0.024335
18:40:40,3354950,29.995592,99.996140,-0.010027
18:40:43,3354837,29.994581,99.992767,-0.018786
18:40:46,3354999,29.996031,99.997604,-0.006222
18:40:48,3354917,29.995296,99.995155,-0.012584
18:40:51,3354964,29.995718,99.996559,-0.008937
18:40:54,3355026,29.996271,99.998405,-0.004142
18:40:57,3354996,29.996002,99.997505,-0.006480
18:40:59,3355043,29.996424,99.998917,-0.002814
18:41:02,3354862,29.994804,99.993515,-0.016844
18:41:05,3354937,29.995476,99.995750,-0.011038
18:41:07,3354816,29.994392,99.992142,-0.020411
18:41:10,3354947,29.995564,99.996048,-0.010265
18:41:13,3354773,29.994009,99.990860,-0.023740
18:41:15,3355029,29.996298,99.998497,-0.003904
18:41:18,3354851,29.994705,99.993187,-0.017696
18:41:21,3354962,29.995699,99.996498,-0.009096
18:41:24,3354814,29.994375,99.992081,-0.020570
18:41:26,3354767,29.993956,99.990685,-0.024196
18:41:29,3354943,29.995529,99.995934,-0.010562
18:41:32,3354986,29.995913,99.997208,-0.007253
18:41:34,3354937,29.995476,99.995750,-0.011038
18:41:37,3354700,29.993357,99.988686,-0.029388
18:41:40,3354856,29.994751,99.993340,-0.017300
18:41:42,3354902,29.995163,99.994713,-0.013733
18:41:45,3354849,29.994688,99.993126,-0.017855
18:41:48,3354884,29.995003,99.994179,-0.015120
18:41:51,3355109,29.997013,100.000877,0.002279
18:41:53,3354854,29.994734,99.993279,-0.017458
18:41:56,3355030,29.996307,99.998528,-0.003825
18:41:59,3354801,29.994259,99.991699,-0.021560
18:42:01,3354801,29.994259,99.991699,-0.021560
18:42:04,3354670,29.993090,99.987801,-0.031687
18:42:07,3354845,29.994654,99.993011,-0.018152
18:42:09,3354833,29.994545,99.992653,-0.019083
18:42:12,3354631,29.992739,99.986626,-0.034739
18:42:15,3354947,29.995564,99.996048,-0.010265
18:42:18,3355043,29.996424,99.998917,-0.002814
18:42:20,3354955,29.995638,99.996292,-0.009631
18:42:23,3354815,29.994385,99.992119,-0.020471
18:42:26,3354539,29.991917,99.983887,-0.041853
18:42:28,3354816,29.994392,99.992142,-0.020411
18:42:31,3354863,29.994814,99.993546,-0.016765
18:42:34,3354743,29.993740,99.989967,-0.026059
18:42:36,3354928,29.995396,99.995483,-0.011731

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-3-31 00:25:28 | 显示全部楼层
有始有终的项目贴,不错

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-4-4 10:48:45 | 显示全部楼层
太专业了,学习了。

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-4-4 11:38:43 | 显示全部楼层
最近在用ad7190,买了一块官方的评估板,官方的板子还是比较有水平的,自己做的第一版噪声控制明显没有官方做的好,建议多参考官方的设计

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-4-4 12:19:12 | 显示全部楼层
这帖子得标记一下

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-4-20 10:24:24 | 显示全部楼层
确实探头很重要,计量院用的设备的照片(当时是做恒温水浴标定)

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出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-4-26 20:27:39 | 显示全部楼层
刚做了1248测温的板子,用fluke恒温槽做标定,查找表的方式,0.1度为一个刻度,标定了10~25度范围。
现在的ADC显示屏的示数与恒温机箱的误差在0.01以内,可见下表:
恒温机箱温度(℃)                20.00           23.10        22.60        22.50        23.90        24.10        24.50        24.80
1248温度(℃)                   19.994        23.103        22.590        22.490        23.902        24.099        24.500        24.797
                                        19.995        23.105      22.593        22.491        23.906        24.104        24.495        24.795
                                        19.992        23.103        22.594        22.487        23.907        24.102        24.500        24.799
                                        19.993        23.104        22.593        22.487        23.906        24.104        24.496        24.799
                                        19.993        23.101        22.596        22.489        23.904        24.105        24.497        24.796
                                        19.994        23.101        22.592        22.488        23.906        24.105        24.499        24.797
                                        19.996.        23.101        22.593        22.489        23.905        24.108        24.501        24.796
                                        19.995        23.102        22.595        22.488        23.902        24.107        24.500        24.798
                                        19.995        23.103        22.597        22.491        23.903        24.106        24.502        24.797
                                        19.994        23.101        22.598        22.492        23.900        24.105        24.499        24.796
RMS(℃)                                19.9942        23.1024        22.5941        22.4892        23.9041        24.1042        24.4989        24.7965
RMSE(℃)                        1.36E-06        1.84E-06        5.29E-06        2.76E-06        4.69E-06        6.36E-06        4.49E-06        1.85E-06

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-5-3 21:39:04 | 显示全部楼层
此贴的讨论让我受益匪浅,各位都是专家啊。

出50入0汤圆

发表于 2017-5-3 22:05:20 | 显示全部楼层
hy2515131 发表于 2017-4-4 11:38
最近在用ad7190,买了一块官方的评估板,官方的板子还是比较有水平的,自己做的第一版噪声控制明显没有官方 ...

请问下用AD7190测量一个零差分信号跳动到多少个LSB呢?我的死活跳动15个LSB,5,6个小时内,最高精度了,斩波使能,开缓冲,算下来只有20个bit

出0入4汤圆

发表于 2017-5-3 22:38:55 | 显示全部楼层
除了电路做的号,传感器也得好啊

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-5-4 21:56:51 | 显示全部楼层
cddyy 发表于 2017-5-3 22:05
请问下用AD7190测量一个零差分信号跳动到多少个LSB呢?我的死活跳动15个LSB,5,6个小时内,最高精度了, ...

我是做高速的采集4800sps,不是精度的采集!

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2017-5-5 09:18:53 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2017-3-2 21:29
老大,您理解错了。我说的只是pt探头,没说后面的AD。托ADI和TI的福,现在国产的24位AD已经像点样了,满 ...

redroof你为何这么吊,,专门搞电路的吗,芯片库这么大!

我的ADC直接用stm32的12位分辨率的就搞掂了,用tlp431当基准,,实际效果感觉10位精度都达不到.  不做软件滤波的话,还飘来飘去..

平时写代码驱动不?

出0入4汤圆

发表于 2018-2-5 10:08:38 | 显示全部楼层
这个PT100的讨论好精彩,感谢奉献的朋友

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2018-3-31 10:40:25 | 显示全部楼层
这么高的精确,要是能实现就厉害了

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2018-4-20 16:34:17 | 显示全部楼层
收藏了,112楼分辨率真高

出0入4汤圆

发表于 2018-5-15 11:52:18 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2017-3-3 09:32
直接给AD供电的电源肯定得是LDO,不能是DCDC。至于是1086还是别的什么小功率的LDO我倒是认为无所谓。最好 ...

请教下,
1,要达到这样的精度,电源的影响是非常大的。能不能对电源有具体量化的要求?比如噪声小于多少,纹波小于多少 ?还是说用常用的方法电源噪声Vpp<PSRR*Vref/2^24即可?
2,大部分的LDO对于10K以上的纹波抑制能力很弱,到了100k左右几乎都直通率,有没有有效的办法降低纹波(非电池供电)?

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2018-5-15 14:13:24 | 显示全部楼层
感谢redroof大神!

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2018-5-15 15:53:04 | 显示全部楼层
bolizhicheng204 发表于 2018-5-15 11:52
请教下,
1,要达到这样的精度,电源的影响是非常大的。能不能对电源有具体量化的要求?比如噪声小于多少 ...

在LDO前面加LC滤波就行。LC对高频的抑制能力比只用C要好得多。
另外,其实常规的低速24位AD对电源的要求并不像你想象的那么高。电源上的高频纹波并不明显影响测量结果。我实测过。

出0入4汤圆

发表于 2018-5-15 17:00:57 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2018-5-15 15:53
在LDO前面加LC滤波就行。LC对高频的抑制能力比只用C要好得多。
另外,其实常规的低速24位AD对电源的要求 ...


根据你的经验,纹波大概控制在多大范围比较好?或者说,你在实测的时候,多大纹波不影响结果?

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2018-5-15 17:25:56 | 显示全部楼层
bolizhicheng204 发表于 2018-5-15 17:00
根据你的经验,纹波大概控制在多大范围比较好?或者说,你在实测的时候,多大纹波不影响结果? ...

感觉几十毫伏之内的纹波都是没关系的
你也很难得到更低的纹波了,个位数毫伏的纹波非常难做到~

出0入4汤圆

发表于 2018-5-15 17:29:17 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2018-5-15 17:25
感觉几十毫伏之内的纹波都是没关系的
你也很难得到更低的纹波了,个位数毫伏的纹波非常难做到~
...

明白,多谢!

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2018-5-15 21:12:24 | 显示全部楼层
这个PT100的讨论好精彩,感谢奉献的朋友

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2018-5-24 21:44:36 | 显示全部楼层
分辨率可以。精度不好做。主要是要校准--你没有标准温度对比源

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2018-8-20 21:26:29 | 显示全部楼层
话说有没作过惠斯通电桥法和恒流源比例法的比较?各自的优缺点

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2018-8-20 21:27:33 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2018-5-15 15:53
在LDO前面加LC滤波就行。LC对高频的抑制能力比只用C要好得多。
另外,其实常规的低速24位AD对电源的要求 ...

哥们你做的PT100测量是用惠斯通电桥还是恒流源比例法?

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2018-8-21 09:14:08 | 显示全部楼层
ljq77402 发表于 2018-8-20 21:27
哥们你做的PT100测量是用惠斯通电桥还是恒流源比例法?

当然是恒流源比例法。
所有的台表都是用恒流源比例法工作的。
电桥法只是在很久很久以前,高精度电阻比减法器便宜的年代才用的,现在没什么意义了。桥臂的另外几个电阻都得是精密基准级别的电阻,太贵,而作用仅仅是省掉了现在做法里面的软件减法。。。
恒流源比例法甚至可以用同一个基准电阻来测很多路PT100,这样要经济的多

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2018-8-21 15:26:20 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2018-8-21 09:14
当然是恒流源比例法。
所有的台表都是用恒流源比例法工作的。
电桥法只是在很久很久以前,高精度电阻比减 ...

redroof大侠,再请教个问题:
今天我查了几个生产PT100的公司给的资料,发现他们的PT100最高级(1/3DIN B 级),标称的在100度时,也有0.27度的误差(PT100阻值误差对应的温度误差)。如果厂家都没法提供高精度的PT100探头,那如果要做0.1度以下的仪表,是不是只能通过实际恒温槽去软件标定了,而无法通过精密电阻去校准了。

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2018-8-21 15:39:32 | 显示全部楼层
wuha 发表于 2018-8-21 15:26
redroof大侠,再请教个问题:
今天我查了几个生产PT100的公司给的资料,发现他们的PT100最高级(1/3DIN B ...

贺利氏可以买到成品1/10B级别的探头。
但是1/10B级别的探头的价格,应该已经超过你能买到的最好的AD加上最好的参考电阻。
因此不要试图自己校准。
你做的这个东西的价钱,应该不值得你去买一套能在100度误差0.1度的温度校准设备。
稍微差一点的探头,自身的重复性都不一定保证在100度的时候有0.1度,你再有钱去校准都没意义。

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2018-8-21 15:40:35 | 显示全部楼层
wuha 发表于 2018-8-21 15:26
redroof大侠,再请教个问题:
今天我查了几个生产PT100的公司给的资料,发现他们的PT100最高级(1/3DIN B ...

你去找一下,看看有几个仪表可以保证在100度的时候误差0.1度,这些仪表多少钱

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发表于 2018-8-21 15:51:43 | 显示全部楼层
用恒压源电阻分压的方式做了一个16路的温度采集,0-100度去方正校准校了一下刚好0.1的准确度!后面想改恒流源发现得切换量程比较复杂就没改!

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发表于 2018-8-21 16:08:48 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2018-8-21 15:40
你去找一下,看看有几个仪表可以保证在100度的时候误差0.1度,这些仪表多少钱 ...

刚跟一个做过测温的同事沟通了下。他们原先公司量产的热量表,要求精度是0.05度(国标要求),他们是用一种电容充放电方法测PT1000的阻值。然后标定了20度和70度两个点。具体标定方法是,用一台稳定度较高的恒温水槽(网上搜索有宣称稳定度在0.01度的),然后用个更高精度的PT1000+电阻桥去测当前水温,稳定后,批量放入校准的仪表探头,开始标定。您认为他们这种方法咋样。

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发表于 2018-8-21 16:40:01 | 显示全部楼层
wuha 发表于 2018-8-21 16:08
刚跟一个做过测温的同事沟通了下。他们原先公司量产的热量表,要求精度是0.05度(国标要求),他们是用一 ...

当然可以啊,如果探头和仪表永远绑定,而且你又只要小范围测温的话。

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发表于 2018-8-21 16:49:11 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2018-8-21 16:40
当然可以啊,如果探头和仪表永远绑定,而且你又只要小范围测温的话。

如果用恒温槽标定的话,是不是选个精度低的PT100探头就行了,只要稳定性可以

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2018-8-21 17:08:54 | 显示全部楼层
wuha 发表于 2018-8-21 16:49
如果用恒温槽标定的话,是不是选个精度低的PT100探头就行了,只要稳定性可以 ...

我不知道低精度探头的线性究竟如何。不过如果你的测温范围不大,取两个端点加上1/3和2/3的量程(一共4个点)来标定一条三次函数,应当是够的。
只要这个探头的重复性没问题就行

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发表于 2018-10-18 23:38:17 来自手机 | 显示全部楼层
不错,谢谢谢谢

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发表于 2018-10-21 15:27:30 | 显示全部楼层
等有什么问题再请教

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发表于 2018-10-21 21:54:40 | 显示全部楼层
分辨率好做,但精度,还是别想了。精度能做到0.1就够牛了,而且成本还很高。如果要做到0.01精度,估计要好几万到几十万元硬件成本吧。

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 楼主| 发表于 2019-3-17 19:58:39 来自手机 | 显示全部楼层
晚枫 发表于 2018-10-21 21:54
分辨率好做,但精度,还是别想了。精度能做到0.1就够牛了,而且成本还很高。如果要做到0.01精度,估计要好 ...

是精度0.05度设计要求 实际做到0.03附近 已经去计量院拿了报告

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发表于 2019-3-17 20:37:09 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 redroof 于 2019-3-17 20:38 编辑
lyzhangxiang 发表于 2019-3-17 19:58
是精度0.05度设计要求 实际做到0.03附近 已经去计量院拿了报告


你应该是只做了测PT100电阻的电路吧?到计量院也是拿标准电阻来检验,再换算为温度。对吧?

测电阻精确到这个数倒是不难,但不知道真正能精确到0.03度的PT100探头要多少钱一个

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发表于 2019-3-18 07:23:08 | 显示全部楼层
难度很大,不可能实现

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 楼主| 发表于 2019-3-20 13:40:06 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2019-3-17 20:37
你应该是只做了测PT100电阻的电路吧?到计量院也是拿标准电阻来检验,再换算为温度。对吧?

测电阻精确 ...

实际的探头测试的 上海计量院测试的
他们有模拟温度的源 至于是否是真的0.03我就不知道了 我是根据他实际的环境校准的
误差0.03以内 给了报告 关键是很贵
我朋友去搞的 我没去 大概情况是这样的 前几天他给我看了报告 呵呵 可能是花钱买来的

出0入0汤圆

 楼主| 发表于 2019-3-20 13:42:43 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2019-3-17 20:37
你应该是只做了测PT100电阻的电路吧?到计量院也是拿标准电阻来检验,再换算为温度。对吧?

测电阻精确 ...

探头里面的pt是贺利氏的  封装也是在德国 他手上好像就这么一根 想买人家不卖 听说是什么项目上面拆下来的 比较贵
https://www.heraeus.com/cn/group/home/home.aspx

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2019-3-20 19:56:32 | 显示全部楼层
lyzhangxiang 发表于 2019-3-20 13:40
实际的探头测试的 上海计量院测试的
他们有模拟温度的源 至于是否是真的0.03我就不知道了 我是根据他实际 ...

用的手上独一份的探头,那么你这个报告的效力就很低啊。这可不是好事。
现在你花了这个钱,只是证明了你这个特定的探头加你的仪器整体是符合指标的。除非是你直接把这个整体卖给客户,否则等于啥也没证明。
就算卖整体,你也只能卖这一套。对另一个仪器硬件,只能重新来测一次

出0入0汤圆

 楼主| 发表于 2019-3-21 12:41:31 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2019-3-20 19:56
用的手上独一份的探头,那么你这个报告的效力就很低啊。这可不是好事。
现在你花了这个钱,只是证明了你 ...

是的 每个板子+探头独立测试

普通的网上买的200块一根的pt100大概测试 有些点不好 0-20区间大概在 0.02 其他点 有的0.1 有的0.2 不太

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2019-3-21 14:25:27 | 显示全部楼层
lyzhangxiang 发表于 2019-3-21 12:41
是的 每个板子+探头独立测试

普通的网上买的200块一根的pt100大概测试 有些点不好 0-20区间大概在 0.02  ...

不要忘了,这一份报告的费用也需要加到你的单价里面啊。报告的费用肯定超过2千了
我感觉还不如你去用淘宝上的两千块钱一个的一等标准铂电阻算了。那种电阻自带校准证书,你只检验测电阻的功能要容易得多。

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 楼主| 发表于 2019-3-21 19:48:53 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2019-3-21 14:25
不要忘了,这一份报告的费用也需要加到你的单价里面啊。报告的费用肯定超过2千了
我感觉还不如 ...

远远不止2千啊 好像7-8千
有点贵 可能是需要整体报告 板子和探头一起出报告

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发表于 2019-5-19 18:23:19 | 显示全部楼层
mark,待学习!

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发表于 2019-7-18 18:18:31 | 显示全部楼层
lyzhangxiang 发表于 2019-3-21 19:48
远远不止2千啊 好像7-8千
有点贵 可能是需要整体报告 板子和探头一起出报告 ...

楼主你好,我想问下,如果基准电阻取100R,用恒流源驱动,怎么用呢?
一般的AD芯片推荐的基准电阻都是5K左右,如果200ua的驱动电流,会获取1V左右的电压,作为参考源进行比例运算,如图所示。
但是,我看你前面写的是100R的基准电阻,100R×200ua=0.02V这也太小了,一般的AD如果打开BUFF,都会要求输入电压高一点,0.02V一般都检测不到了,怎么用呢?
多谢!

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出200入657汤圆

发表于 2019-7-18 18:59:46 | 显示全部楼层
Knowing nothing feels like knowing everything.

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 楼主| 发表于 2019-7-18 20:31:51 | 显示全部楼层
bolizhicheng204 发表于 2019-7-18 18:18
楼主你好,我想问下,如果基准电阻取100R,用恒流源驱动,怎么用呢?
一般的AD芯片推荐的基准电阻都是5K ...

我没有使用ad片内的恒流源 用外部的参考源+运放搭建的横流源哦

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发表于 2019-7-19 08:53:07 | 显示全部楼层
lyzhangxiang 发表于 2019-7-18 20:31
我没有使用ad片内的恒流源 用外部的参考源+运放搭建的横流源哦


问题是就算外部的恒流源,200ua驱动在100R的基准电阻上的压降只有0.02V,这么小的电压在BUFF打开的时候低于最低电压的要求,怎么采呢?是通过运放把电压放大了吗?

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发表于 2019-7-19 10:03:15 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2019-3-21 14:25
不要忘了,这一份报告的费用也需要加到你的单价里面啊。报告的费用肯定超过2千了
我感觉还不如 ...

国内很多单位建标时,就要看计量院的检定证书。
所以不管你买了多好的探头,必须到计量院检定一次,出的报告也必须是温度的检定报告。

而且更奇葩的是,你可以先用它的设备对自己的仪器标定一遍,马上再用它的设备检定。
只要你的仪器稳定性不是太糟,。。。。。。。。。

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2019-7-19 10:15:32 | 显示全部楼层
wochai 发表于 2019-7-19 10:03
国内很多单位建标时,就要看计量院的检定证书。
所以不管你买了多好的探头,必须到计量院检定一次,出的 ...

是让你直接买个已经带有计量院证书的探头啊~~
卖探头的厂家替你送计量院检定过的
他们批量去检定,比你自己去做便宜,而且省你的时间~

出100入0汤圆

发表于 2019-7-19 10:29:55 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2019-7-19 10:15
是让你直接买个已经带有计量院证书的探头啊~~
卖探头的厂家替你送计量院检定过的
他们批量去检定,比你 ...

没用啊,别人就是要整套仪器(包含探头)的检定证书。

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2019-7-19 10:38:15 | 显示全部楼层
wochai 发表于 2019-7-19 10:29
没用啊,别人就是要整套仪器(包含探头)的检定证书。

你买个高位台表,它自带的证书里面就写明了测温挡位的精度(不含探头)
然后再买个带有证书的探头,合起来不就是了?

就算再贵的台表,标称的测温精度都是不含探头的啊,探头总是让你自己买的。两者的误差加起来就是总误差,无需整套合起来检定一次。

出0入0汤圆

 楼主| 发表于 2019-7-19 12:41:05 | 显示全部楼层
bolizhicheng204 发表于 2019-7-19 08:53
问题是就算外部的恒流源,200ua驱动在100R的基准电阻上的压降只有0.02V,这么小的电压在BUFF打开的时候低 ...

是的 我用外部电路实现恒流源 电流应该不是200uA 我晚上回去确认下
因为我没关心电流 直接看电压的 有个调节驱动电流的电位计 用的进口的几十块的那种

出0入4汤圆

发表于 2019-7-19 15:06:57 | 显示全部楼层
lyzhangxiang 发表于 2019-7-19 12:41
是的 我用外部电路实现恒流源 电流应该不是200uA 我晚上回去确认下
因为我没关心电流 直接看电压的 有个 ...

嗯嗯,一直在考虑两个方案,方案1:用5K左右的基准电阻,这样电压不用放大可以直接进AD采样,但是0.01%精度的5K的电阻带来的误差会比100R的电阻大;方案2:就是你这个方案0.01%精度的100R电阻,精度相比会好很多,但是需要放大电路。

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2019-7-19 15:54:01 来自手机 | 显示全部楼层
bolizhicheng204 发表于 2019-7-19 15:06
嗯嗯,一直在考虑两个方案,方案1:用5K左右的基准电阻,这样电压不用放大可以直接进AD采样,但是0.01%精 ...

同样精度,为什么5k电阻的误差比100欧大?

出0入0汤圆

 楼主| 发表于 2019-7-19 17:04:28 | 显示全部楼层
bolizhicheng204 发表于 2019-7-19 15:06
嗯嗯,一直在考虑两个方案,方案1:用5K左右的基准电阻,这样电压不用放大可以直接进AD采样,但是0.01%精 ...

感觉你还没理解我的意思呢
我的方案 恒流源通过电位器调整 输出合适的值。能够保证流过参考电阻和被测电阻的电流 形成的电压能够很好的被我的adc采集就可以了
最终被采集电阻 就能够通过两个电阻上的电压比例和参考电阻 换算出来
所以我只需要保证 这个参考电阻足够准就行了 当然恒流源不波动对处理也有好处 毕竟如果需要很好的精度需要把adc的rate降低

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2019-7-20 10:21:30 | 显示全部楼层
精度0.1都不太容易

出0入4汤圆

发表于 2019-7-22 09:07:52 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2019-7-19 15:54
同样精度,为什么5k电阻的误差比100欧大?

周末有点事没来得及看。首先感谢redroof大侠指点!
经你这么一问,确实不知道该怎么理解这个误差了,按照比例法,Rpt=(Vpt × Ref )/Vref,按说Rpt计算出来的精度会受Ref的影响,但是Ref的精度变化同时带来Vref的变化。这个地方应该怎么去理解呢

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2019-7-22 09:13:32 | 显示全部楼层
bolizhicheng204 发表于 2019-7-22 09:07
周末有点事没来得及看。首先感谢redroof大侠指点!
经你这么一问,确实不知道该怎么理解这个误差了,按照 ...

用恒流源比例法测电阻,本质上你测到的AD值代表给基准输入端供电的电阻和被测电阻之间的比值。这个比值的精度只跟AD的线性度有关。
你计算被测电阻的误差,就是参考电阻的误差加上AD的线性度误差。别的没了

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发表于 2019-7-22 09:27:31 | 显示全部楼层
这老帖怎又被挖而重出土了?!几年前有发射了颗那种探测宇宙暗物质的科研卫星,上面载有解析度为百万分之一摄氏度的感测器,不过想定这感测器应是买不到,就算拿到了也难捣鼓才是。

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发表于 2019-7-22 09:40:13 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2019-7-22 09:13
用恒流源比例法测电阻,本质上你测到的AD值代表给基准输入端供电的电阻和被测电阻之间的比值。这个比值的 ...

嗯嗯,好多AD的BUFF打开后要求大于一个电压值,如果采样电阻是100的话需要放大才能被识别。但是如果换成K级别就能被AD检测,不需要额外加放大了。最近突然对这部分感兴趣,回头做实验看看。

出0入4汤圆

发表于 2019-7-22 09:52:10 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2019-7-19 15:54
同样精度,为什么5k电阻的误差比100欧大?

可是根据你前面的讲解
“如果要自己做,就去mouser/digikey买个万分之一的5ppm基准电阻,用你能买到的最好的24位AD做比例测量即可。比如ADS1256档次足够了。
电阻对电阻的比例测量并不难,你可以做到的精度就是AD的线性加上你的基准电阻的误差。大约就是万分之一阻值。100欧*万分之一阻值=0.01欧=0.025゜C”

AD的线性加上你的基准电阻的误差:那基准电阻的误差0.01%×100R=0.01欧,和0.01%×5K=0.5欧,这不是差别很大吗?

出300入477汤圆

发表于 2019-7-22 10:14:58 | 显示全部楼层
bolizhicheng204 发表于 2019-7-22 09:52
可是根据你前面的讲解
“如果要自己做,就去mouser/digikey买个万分之一的5ppm基准电阻,用你能买到的最 ...

不乘电阻值,只看误差比例。比例都是相对自身而言。

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2019-8-8 13:55:04 | 显示全部楼层
redroof 发表于 2017-3-1 11:41
请用比较法测电阻。这样你的精度完全取决于AD的线性以及你那个超精密基准电阻的稳定性和温漂,跟别的啥都 ...

“比较法测电阻”
请教一下,这个怎么搞法?电桥电路么?

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2019-11-17 14:38:48 | 显示全部楼层
看着没有下文了,楼主不能SHOW一下 你自己做的东西么!围观一下

出10入12汤圆

发表于 2019-11-22 23:26:59 来自手机 | 显示全部楼层
关键是怎么标定!!!

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2019-11-23 07:33:07 来自手机 | 显示全部楼层
学习了   

出0入0汤圆

 楼主| 发表于 2019-11-23 09:14:48 | 显示全部楼层
weidadejang 发表于 2019-11-17 14:38
看着没有下文了,楼主不能SHOW一下 你自己做的东西么!围观一下

写代码的 做硬件水平不行 装机图敏感 只发几张研发阶段的pcb









立创贴片的半成品自己补焊 这种板子得好好洗洗 不然测不准的

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出0入0汤圆

 楼主| 发表于 2019-11-23 09:16:58 | 显示全部楼层
补充:
2年前的项目  很久不弄了

出0入0汤圆

 楼主| 发表于 2019-11-23 09:20:15 | 显示全部楼层
wowangru 发表于 2019-11-22 23:26
关键是怎么标定!!!

实验室去标定 做了配套的上位机 发送指令完成标定
温度都是计算出来的 测量只是一小部分
老外的做法是探头里面带芯片每次标定结果写入探头 这个方式最合理

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2019-11-23 09:43:27 | 显示全部楼层
精度需要从整个系统角度来把握,信号的前段防护,中段抗噪声滤波,后端的运放选型及A/D处理,外加PCB的的走线~

出0入0汤圆

发表于 2019-11-25 10:53:15 | 显示全部楼层
小板子上那腿比较多的 是什么片子!

出0入0汤圆

 楼主| 发表于 2019-11-26 12:26:55 | 显示全部楼层
weidadejang 发表于 2019-11-25 10:53
小板子上那腿比较多的 是什么片子!

楼主位提到的adi芯片
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